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Author Topic: More songwriting gibberish  (Read 1968 times)

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Offline Jahva

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More songwriting gibberish
« on: August 28, 2013, 12:49:33 PM »
After i finish a song and let it blister in the sun for a few days I'll look back at it  and evaluate it... most leave me with a feeling that i missed the mark. And that's ok still learning, but I do feel a sense of disappointment in some and others completion.

So... my question is what are the factors that make up a good song to you?
I would guess we all see it a little different based on what we can do on how we go about creating something...
What are the elements you try to put into the stew as you're creating... or maybe you don't think about it? Just let it go where it goes...
Does it have something to grab attention a piece or part that has one or more of those things
Playin' the mind guerrilla Chantin' the mantra, peace on earth

JL

Offline Joom

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Re: More songwriting gibberish
« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2013, 01:42:22 PM »
Aw, man, when I saw the title I was expecting real gibberish.  :-[ :P

Pretty much exactly what you laid out, Jahva.  Unless it's the once a year serious song, I try to just have fun with it, hoping that will make it fun for the listener.  Catchy music and/or lyrics yes, but sometimes more the delivery.

I always tell people to go back and listen to some of their favorite fun (or serious) songs and listen again to the vocal delivery.  The nuances, the timing, the inflection in the just the right places on just the right syllables, pitch or note changes, harmonies, etc.  Two people can sing the same song in basically the same way, and have two completely different outcomes.  There have been some very popular songs over the years that aren't really complicated or have an extravagant musical accompaniment, but they're sung in a way that just hits home.

But of course you can't discount great tunes, riffs, changeups, and a hundred other things that work together to be just exactly what the song needs...
A computer once beat me at chess - but as it turns out it was no match for me at kickboxing... ;)

Offline Jahva

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Re: More songwriting gibberish
« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2013, 04:48:50 PM »
I think you have to also determine what you're good at and harness it... I guess. Some are really exceptional players while others may be really good with lyric or arrangement... but sometimes we can't see what's missing. Need fresh ears.
(edited  ::))
« Last Edit: August 28, 2013, 09:11:34 PM by Jahva »
Playin' the mind guerrilla Chantin' the mantra, peace on earth

JL

Offline Joom

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Re: More songwriting gibberish
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2013, 07:54:04 PM »
I can always tell what's missing, I just don't tell anybody else...  :P
« Last Edit: September 19, 2013, 09:32:33 AM by Joom »
A computer once beat me at chess - but as it turns out it was no match for me at kickboxing... ;)

Offline Jahva

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Re: More songwriting gibberish
« Reply #4 on: August 29, 2013, 07:17:01 AM »
How bout.... throw some chords together and just trust your instincts.
Find a groove or jam and wear it out.
I'm sure a lot of good tunes came out of jam sessions in the studio.
Playin' the mind guerrilla Chantin' the mantra, peace on earth

JL

Offline Joom

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Re: More songwriting gibberish
« Reply #5 on: August 29, 2013, 08:01:46 AM »
How bout.... throw some chords together and just trust your instincts.
Find a groove or jam and wear it out.
I'm sure a lot of good tunes came out of jam sessions in the studio.

Absolutely...
A computer once beat me at chess - but as it turns out it was no match for me at kickboxing... ;)

Offline neilmac

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Re: More songwriting gibberish
« Reply #6 on: August 29, 2013, 08:24:20 AM »
How bout.... throw some chords together and just trust your instincts.
Find a groove or jam and wear it out.
I'm sure a lot of good tunes came out of jam sessions in the studio.

Yep, that's pretty much what I do :P
I basically screw around till I find something I like and let it grow from there.... :)

Offline Jahva

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Re: More songwriting gibberish
« Reply #7 on: August 29, 2013, 08:36:17 AM »
Yeah me to Neil... most of the time. But sometimes I do try to find a feel or groove.
I'm working on this tune and I intentionally wanted to have kind of a 60's Rock-n-Roll ala Yardbyrds/Aerosmith feel about it. Big 10 inch walking the dog kind of sound.
Some dirty guitar sounds and dirty lyrics to match... sort of. We'll see how good my aim is when it's done.  ::)
« Last Edit: August 29, 2013, 08:40:18 AM by Jahva »
Playin' the mind guerrilla Chantin' the mantra, peace on earth

JL

Offline kcc

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Re: More songwriting gibberish
« Reply #8 on: September 05, 2013, 01:19:53 AM »
For me it's "the story" of the song. Is it complete, can it be visualized, as has been mentioned is there a take-away lyric that stands out? Does it have a "hook", is it "hum-able"?


I really have a visual bent when I'm writing. I try to describe what I see to the listeners through the lyrics.  One tune I really enjoyed writing was "New England Christmas" I think it has some great imagery throughout. But I tried to vividly set the scene from the start:

c.
Windows burning with candle light
Snow fields sparkling in the full moon light
Our horse's breath rising up out of sight
as he pulls our Christmas tree home.


v3.
The cobbler made with Linny's lovin'
is warming in the bee hive oven
and the goose is slowly turning
over glowing Chris-a-mas coals
and what do you bet
the table's been set
and the twin's have tried the rolls.


I'm not alway's successful - and sometimes very hokey - but I really enjoy the process of working/polishing a tune

Good luck on your "rock-n-roll" tune Jahva! I have the hardest time trying to emulate other styles - I think it speaks to my level of talent!


kc
« Last Edit: September 05, 2013, 01:25:53 AM by kcc »
That sounded great! Let's do it again!

Offline Jahva

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Re: More songwriting gibberish
« Reply #9 on: September 05, 2013, 08:44:11 AM »
Yeah kcc the hook is oh so important. Most good songs the hook raises the bar on the song for one reason or another.
 Sometimes the delivery is more important than the words.
Think of the simplest lines and punch em above everything else in the song
When the Beatles sang "She loves you Yeah Yeah Yeah" nobody thinks about the music underneath that. It's the delivery... it takes over. Before that you kind of groove to the rhythm then bam it hits you like a sledgehammer.

RE: "New England Christmas"  Nice lines... and yeah it is an easy one to picture.
Did you finish it, music and all?
Believe me I know hokey. I keep it in me back pocket and get my share of it. But there's an honesty in it. We can't be all badazz all the time now....  :P I'd say at least half of what I write would fall under the hokey category. I don't worry about it... my kids have said to me for years.  :D

Playin' the mind guerrilla Chantin' the mantra, peace on earth

JL

Offline Jahva

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Re: More songwriting gibberish
« Reply #10 on: September 19, 2013, 09:08:36 AM »
Where do your lyrics come from?

I make chit up probably half the time just to make rhymes. Maybe more than half...
I find listening to other musicians gives me both musical and lyrical ideas... I'll sometimes take someone elses theme, line and reword it. By the time I'm finished with it there is little to no resemblence of where it came from.
 
yeah so... where do your lyrics come from?
Playin' the mind guerrilla Chantin' the mantra, peace on earth

JL

Offline Joom

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Re: More songwriting gibberish
« Reply #11 on: September 19, 2013, 09:34:16 AM »
yeah so... where do your lyrics come from?

Aliens, mostly...  ;)
A computer once beat me at chess - but as it turns out it was no match for me at kickboxing... ;)

Offline Jahva

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Re: More songwriting gibberish
« Reply #12 on: September 19, 2013, 11:23:05 AM »
Aliens, mostly...  ;)
The illegal kind...  :P
Playin' the mind guerrilla Chantin' the mantra, peace on earth

JL

Offline Joom

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Re: More songwriting gibberish
« Reply #13 on: September 19, 2013, 11:31:56 AM »
Nah, all three of them have their green cards.  At least that's what they told me when they landed in the back yard in '56...  ;)
A computer once beat me at chess - but as it turns out it was no match for me at kickboxing... ;)